Pre-1960 vehicles exempted from MoT

[Garybond]

If you read the reports by FBHVC there would be a sharp rise in the number of cars still on the DVLA system and used on the road after 1960 and into the seventies so this is the reason for the cut off

[wilksie]

Interesting. I just checked my Nobels V5 and that said 1959 so that ones off the hook. If I can find an Isetta that has a chassis number that is below 321692 and registered in late 59 It will prove that mine was manifactured also in 59. Time to consult the Isetta owners club.

Do you mean a chassis number that is above yours? If so, I can quote you five higher chassis numbers of 1959 models or 1959 registered Isettas. In fact I have details of another two but they are in the three thirties and definitely later cars.

[Rusty Chrome (Malcolm Parker)]

For car tax a "historic vehicle" is classed as being one made pre 1 Jan 1973, yet for the MOT they are using 1960.
Surely the two should tie up?!

I have to say I'm baffled by that as well. The tax was something the Conservatives introdued as a rolling 25-year exemption and Labour fixed to 1973 in 1998. There are numerous petitions, some with over 20,000 signitures calling for a reintroduction of the rolling 25 year exemption along with support from the classic car industry which is completely ignored. This change had a consultation which 477 people responded to and it's a done deal!
The EU legislation would make it more complicated to drop the MOT for post 1960 vehicles, but as far as I know the tax is a purely local issue.

[Garybond]

The Government would lose to much money if they carried on with a rolling tax exempt date there are figures about but it was a very large sum and they have to find the money to give away to all and sundry from somewhere and it is usually the motorist who loses

[Bob Purton]

Interesting. I just checked my Nobels V5 and that said 1959 so that ones off the hook. If I can find an Isetta that has a chassis number that is below 321692 and registered in late 59 It will prove that mine was manifactured also in 59. Time to consult the Isetta owners club.

Do you mean a chassis number that is above yours? If so, I can quote you five higher chassis numbers of 1959 models or 1959 registered Isettas. In fact I have details of another two but they are in the three thirties and definitely later cars.

Of course wilksie, that exactly what I meant. It was late at night when I wrote that, my excuse anyway!  Thats good news then and defo proves mine was manifactured before 1960. Any chance of forwarding me the details via a private message?  CHeers, Bob.

[AndrewG]

For car tax a "historic vehicle" is classed as being one made pre 1 Jan 1973, yet for the MOT they are using 1960.
Surely the two should tie up?!

Maybe the members of the All-Party Parliamentary Historic Vehicles Group only have vehicles from before 1960, so why make it any later date.....?

[Big Al]

Yes it all sounds too simple and good to be true. I did read that you would still be able to voluntarily have your pre 1960 car MOT tested and maybe this is what some insurers will require?

As a buyer would you not ask for an MOT as an engineering check before buying a car? It is still a cheap way to get a car checked out. I believe the French system actually demands this of old vehicles before a change of ownership but no MOT thereafter. Makes perfect sense or else folk will be tucked up with dangerous cars assuming they can drive them.

[Big Al]

For car tax a "historic vehicle" is classed as being one made pre 1 Jan 1973, yet for the MOT they are using 1960.
Surely the two should tie up?!

I have to say I'm baffled by that as well. The tax was something the Conservatives introdued as a rolling 25-year exemption and Labour fixed to 1973 in 1998. There are numerous petitions, some with over 20,000 signitures calling for a reintroduction of the rolling 25 year exemption along with support from the classic car industry which is completely ignored. This change had a consultation which 477 people responded to and it's a done deal!
The EU legislation would make it more complicated to drop the MOT for post 1960 vehicles, but as far as I know the tax is a purely local issue.

We are out of step on this one with many countries. It has helped destroy our position as the world centre for classic cars, which has cost a lot of tax revenue to the State. If they are squeaking about a further loss of revenue then I have very little sympathy as it was a dumb move in 1998 by, oh yes, that financial whizzkid Gordon Brown. You know, the one who lost everyone money equally as a good socialist should, except himself of course.

So we should be on 1987 now. All those cars that have survived to be usable are, in fact, the greenest cars on the road if you include pollution debt. Greener still if owners were encouraged to invest in them so they are bung perfect. So fine, have an MOT, but why tax them as a more modern car? Yet this green agenda is not recognised and the State seems to be hostile to the notion that they remain in use by altering fuel etc to finish them off. The only reason can be fiscal and pressure to bring new cars to the market for turnover of industry, which is not green but lucrative. Many of the owners of these older cars would not buy a newer car anyway so I wonder quite who is kidding who here. Fortunately my interest is pre '73 but to loose the best ranges of cars featuring well designed economic pre computer rubbish engines to the current policy on older cars is boneheaded. My feeling is grab some of the better ones, Pugs 205 405, Citreon BX, etc left before they vanish or face up to paying excessive maintenance charges for tasks you can no longer do on moderns. That or changing your car frequently for a newer version at considerable write of cost. Not playing here.

[Barry]

I didn't want to change the registration numbers on my Morris or Velocette but also didn't want to throw away their 'cherished number' value in November if they could no longer be transferred.

It says on the .gov website that if you want to retain or transfer the reg number the vehicle must have tax and MOT.

There is not much information on exactely what will happen after 18th Nov? (or is it 17th)

I have put the Morris number on a retainer.  I didnt want it to loose its original number but decided to play safe.  I could always put it back on again!!!!
I got an MOT on the Velocett yesterday and tried to tax it today - it is not registered as an Historic vehicle so I phoned Swansea to see how I could get it taxed (without spending £36).
The deadline of 18th Nov is getting tight to change the logbook and retain the number.

It seems Swansea don't really know what will happen after 18th Nov.  

My thought was - no MOT = no transfer of reg number.

The lady said that after Nov 18th will just need to tax the vehicle.  you should still be able to transfer the number but will not need an MOT.  I said that I wasn't sure about that, and I don't think she was.

I asked for some written details - she did not have any.  email your enquiry on www.gov.uk/emaildvla and they will write back.

She said that most classic car owners keep their cars in good condition so everything would be all right.................

I suggested that there are lots of old wrecks out in peoples sheds and gardens.  Provided they have a V5c, does that mean you simply have to tax them and then sell/retain the number plate.  no need for MOT?

This could be very good news for people with old scrappers.
It could be bad news for your pre 60 classic with a £30,000 number plate.

I don't think Swansea know the answer.  They said it would be clearer on November 18th?

[Big Al]

What a mess. If Scotland get independence they could offer MOT free MOT motoring up until 1965 just to be annoying. And we all wonder why these burks in charge have got us into a rather nasty economic situation? 'Which way did it go. George? Which way did it go'?

Well the transfer thing could go one of three ways couldn't it.

You cannot do it as no MOT.

You can do it to anything as an MOT is not valid any more.

Or the most likely as the law still exists and it will act as a check on DVLA's lucrative little sideline. You need an MOT test to transfer the number, nominating the tester as the agent of DVLA to check the car's details in the absence of LVO's and that it is roadworthy. (never worked out why a number had to be roadworthy rather than the donar car but, hey, we are talking Government bollocks here so sense has nothing to do with it).

but........

Worst of all you can transfer the number but the car then has to be scrapped by a licensed company or put in for re registration thus keeping old car haters happy. You know, the ones with a personalised numberplate.

[Barry]

I suppose it only affects a few people because most of the valuable registration numbers have long gone onto BMW M5's etc.
My numbers are probably only worth about £1000 - £2000 but that is still quite a (virtual) loss.

COM 1C might make £2000?

HoHoHo - I wish

[Trident]

Surely not allowing registration transfers off pre 1960 vehicles would be a good thing.
I thought  true classic car enthusiasts might value the fact that a car retains its original registration number.

[richard]

always had mixed feelings on this one trident . people in other countries without a lifelong registration number have no problem valuing there vehicles have they ? never sold one - but never had one with a valuable reg - unless you know better 837RVX , 219CLR , HHF684H , UKR696 , etc etc 

i know some have sold the number knowing that if they sell the vehicle for i.e. £1000 the buyer will then recoup by selling the number alone for more - perhaps that is the the answer then - ban selling numbers . DVLA wouldnt like that would they 

[Barry]

I sold the number on my old Austin A35 in about 1980 for £2000  (33 MHK)
The money then went towards the restoration of my Morris Isis.

Should I have left the original number on the A35 for the next owner?  The car was not economically salvageable for restoration at that time, being worth about £100

If someone has a nice original classic vehicle today with a number plate worth £10,000 should they keep it with the car or loose £10,000 on November 18th (perhaps).
At what point/value should the number stay with the car.  At what point do you stop becoming a true enthusiast..............

It's nice to have the original number with the car but my Morris Isis will never be worth lots of money and is of little historic importance apart from being a Cr*p car.
So I think I should reluctantly cash-in on the number plate value.

[richard]

thats it in a nutshell !!