RUMCars Forum
General Category => Unusual Microcar Discussion => Topic started by: Jonathan Poll on December 10, 2011, 11:31:05 PM
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While the site is under construction, why not post pictures of your cars here? It will also make it easier when I edit the site, I wont need to ask each of you to send me pictures, they would be here!
Ok, here goes... Here are my cars!
1958 Nobel 200 and 1963 Messerschmitt kr200
Show us what you've got!
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Wow, fair play to you for quick response. :o
Here is a pic of mine as it came.
Original paint.
(http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s295/lambroman/P5010002.jpg)
Shaun.
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Wow, fair play to you for quick response. :o
Here is a pic of mine as it came.
Original paint.
(http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s295/lambroman/P5010002.jpg)
Shaun.
Not sure if these count, but here are my other "toys" !
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this is now permanently at the top of the list of Microcar Discussion along with "how to post pics" and "who's who?"
I would suggest that anyone who wants to simply post a pic of their car(s) do so in this "Our Cars" thread that was started.
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Jonathan, I think you'll find the Puch Maxi is mine !
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this is now permanently at the top of the list of Microcar Discussion along with "how to post pics" and "who's who?"
I would suggest that anyone who wants to simply post a pic of their car(s) do so in this "Our Cars" thread that was started.
Why not have a members cars gallery section instead of just one topic?
Most car forums have a members cars gallery.
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this is now permanently at the top of the list of Microcar Discussion along with "how to post pics" and "who's who?"
I would suggest that anyone who wants to simply post a pic of their car(s) do so in this "Our Cars" thread that was started.
Why not have a members cars gallery section instead of just one topic?
Most car forums have a members cars gallery.
Not sure how extensive the forum is, but that *will* be a feature on the new website!
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Here's mine:
http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11980.jpg
This You Tube clip has some footage of DUF:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RWR0YMrgiE
Here is some footage of my other car:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMi4-iTgLAI
Here's a 4 engined car which I really love:
http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/Picture1.png
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Here's mine:
http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11980.jpg
This You Tube clip has some footage of DUF:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RWR0YMrgiE
Here is some footage of my other car:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMi4-iTgLAI
Here's a 4 engined car which I really love:
http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/Picture1.png
Rich, instead of linking to the picture of your car, you can click on "insert Image" (not under additional options), but between the smileys and bold, italic, underline etc options.
Here goes:
(http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC11980.jpg)
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Trojan before Rolls Royce, DUF B4 BOB!
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(http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/dufmcr.jpg)(http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/duf.jpg)
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Cat and RISA electric ukulele in DUF
(http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/annierisaduf.jpg)
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Love it!
Here are a couple ofmy dad's toys, his TG500 in 3 stages while my dad owned it. When he got it, it was red with the Mini rear end. He decided tro sell the mini rear end, after finding an original boot (from one of the scrapped Tigers we think) and some rear wings made by Oliver.
Someone wanted to buy 2 TG's of of my dad, including this one, he wanted yellow.
He got the finished one first, and my dad realised after the other was painted yellow, the guy sold it imediately for more money. My dad decided to keep the other because of that, and is now restoring it how he wants it, which is luckily how it was originally; turquoise!
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Nice pics, I presume the red "TG" has a Mini or Imp engine?
Cheers JP, I had forgotten how to post pix on this forum, so that was a good excuse to re-familiarise myself.
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Nice pics, I presume the red "TG" has a Mini or Imp engine?
Cheers JP, I had forgotten how to post pix on this forum, so that was a good excuse to re-familiarise myself.
Yep, mini engine!
just swapped pictures, I put the wrong one on!
Here is a video of it in the old-er days
http://www.kaapioautoyhdistys.fi/ajokit/tg1000.htm
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Mind that cabbage field Bob!
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Dear Marcus
How about Cabbage Patch Bob
Chris Thomas
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Always loved Inters... I prefer the normal models, torpedo looks great in some angles, but also the fact of it being early with the smaller headlight etc makes it look fatter. Love the axles though!
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Wow, there are some serious lush and wierd cars on this site.
This will be an eye opener for me, having had classic cars for years, but only recently seing all the rarer micro's.
This is a pic of my Willam being driven after it was MOT'd:
(http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s295/lambroman/Photo0019.jpg)
And another whilst it was being pre-MOT'd:
(http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s295/lambroman/Photo0014.jpg)
And as people are showing 'peds etc (no offence, its fun to everyones various fun vehicles),
This is my sunny day car,
But I was driving it in the rain today :D
(http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s295/lambroman/P4230003-1.jpg)
Can't find any pics at the mo ???
I am loving the new breed of cars I am seeing.
Shaun.
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I thought Shaun was a sheep, not a goat. ;D
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Always loved Inters... I prefer the normal models, torpedo looks great in some angles, but also the fact of it being early with the smaller headlight etc makes it look fatter. Love the axles though!
Interesting observation Jonathan, in reality all Inters have the same size headlight but the difference between an early one and a late one is the height of the headlight, early ones are high up with the top edge being level with the slope of the nose, later ones are set lower with the nose rounding down towards the light . I think they all look great from the front but pretty odd from the side view.
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Wow, there are some serious lush and wierd cars on this site.
This is a pic of my Willam being driven after it was MOT'd:
I am loving the new breed of cars I am seeing.
Shaun.
It would be good to know more about your MOT Shaun.
Also what information you get on your V5c
I have not gone for an MOT yet as I need to prove the age of my Lawil for the registration.
Will get a message to you off-forum
Barry
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Kid leather sets?! Nice pics!
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Cat and RISA electric ukulele in DUF
(http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/annierisaduf.jpg)
Are the cat and the strings related?
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Perhaps that cat's predecessor! Over the years all four of our cats have loved sitting and sleeping in DUF during nice weather, as soon as the door opens in they go. They shun other vehicles completely. Good taste, those cats. Very nice acoustics in a Heinkel-Trojan, intimate but the large shiny areas prevent PCS.
(Padded Cell Syndrome)
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(Quoting Bob, just made it shorter)
Hmmm... find they look best from that angle! They look sleek!
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A Couple more, DUF at my workshop:
(http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/dufstudios.jpg)
Demented Davros?
(http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss260/Captain_Bubble/SDC10365-1.jpg)
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Here you go: A 1980 KV Mini 1 and a 1981 HMV Freeway. My other KV Mini 1, a '78, is lurking in the background.
(http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1194/4733416900_0a88ae2e30.jpg)
For anyone wondering about the ground clearance on that '82 MG Metro, I should add that I took this photo shortly after one of its rear displacers had ruptured. It's fixed [for] now.
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I thought Shaun was a sheep, not a goat. ;D
:D :D
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This is a pic of my Willam being driven after it was MOT'd:
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It would be good to know more about your MOT Shaun.
Barry
It was a Fourgonne conclusion, I say, a Fourgonne conclusion. Now listen to me while I am talking boy! - 'Leghorn'
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My stuff as of present... :)
(http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z211/stuartcyphus/S7302847.jpg)
(http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z211/stuartcyphus/Thefirstpublicitypictures1.jpg)
(http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z211/stuartcyphus/Picture110.jpg)
(http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z211/stuartcyphus/Picture073.jpg)
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Hey Stuart. Take two Citroen 2CV roofs to fend off a shower? I don't, I turn them into a garage door! Mmm asbestos too. It is almost better than the vehicles is that garage. Needs preserving for the Nation along with corrugated iron Churches.
Check out the Stothert and Pitt dumper. Made by the outfit who's sports ground we used to hold Bath Rally at for yonks. So many links to Microcars.
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One thing I forgot to mention. All of the pictures you post here I am free to put on the website. If there are any you put on and dont want them on the site, please tell me.
Of course I wont use every single picture, but still worth telling.
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Fine with me.
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Questionable Santa with electric reindeer propulsion
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But look what he left me!
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Questionable Santa with electric reindeer propulsion
Hehe love it! Probably goes faster than stock ;)
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to send just one reply, here are all our bubbles....
(http://i44.servimg.com/u/f44/11/44/77/74/coll_b11.jpg)
and as my addiction is for vintage scooters too ...
(http://i44.servimg.com/u/f44/11/44/77/74/dsc_9510.jpg)
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And here are my bikes and cars
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Lovely cars, scooters and bikes!
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Individual photos available for your website or register Jonathan
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Individual photos available for your website or register Jonathan
Not q register, just the website ;)
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NIce collection Jean-do, and to think I believed you when you told me you were poor and couldnt afford an INter! ;)
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I have to admit that I am genuinely mystified as to the reason why there has not been even a single responce to my picture of a Trident under an apparently giant Christmas tree that I managed to post above on the appropriate date of December 26 2011.
The scale of the tree was a contrived illusion, however the Peel in my living room definitely is not.
After waiting a full year and investing a sizeable sum to both procure its manufacture and shipping to my home in California- I am genuinely stumped by the complete lack of recognition by this group.
Did you not understand what you were seeing, or do you just not care? if the latter- why not? ???
Hope I am not letting in a horde with this invite.
At any rate-it seems that everyone that has seen a similar picture on my cell phone's gallery is quite pleasantly amused and intrigued by the image on these shores.
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I think most of the problem Steven, is that ever since all the hoo-haa & bandwagon jumping by the London "Peel" fabricators, & other things, just about everyone is pointly ignoring anything & everything to do with Peels, real or fake, genuine or repro, no matter if its intresting or not. You've only got to look at the way "certain people" used to throw a wobbly every time Peels were mentioned on here. What engine have you gone for for yours? mine is Honda.... :)
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Hi Stuart,
Good to hear from someone who has shared my fate.
i think that certain people have gone overboard in criticizing what is potentially one of the greatest avenues for increasing not just Peel awareness, but Microcar awareness and enthusiasm in general for the coming generations.
Regardles of the Dragon's Den business group's false claims to being tied to the original Peel Engineering firm, and therefore deserving of the derogatory monikers of their critics- the penultimate point is that they have actually put not only outwardly accurate copies of these cars out there, but probably increased Peel and Microcar consciousness more than any other event in recent history. [The 8" wheels look bad, but liability laws have changed & owners can downsize.]
If they were to actually create some sort of Peel park or faux factory- so much the better. For all those certain people out there that seek to kill off anything other than the original pack of maybe 50 or so Peels that survive to this day- What have you, or anyone else that you know of for that matter, done to bring this much new life and enthusiasm and interest in Peels for the coming generations that would top this?
We all know the answer to that one!
I have read that Henry Ford was vehemently anti semitic. So at some levels he was truly not a good guy. But does that mean that we should no longer honor the influence of the Model T on the automotive history of the world?
Perhaps someday in the future, if certain people presently sitting on their thumbs get their way. They will wake up and realize that they have only succeeded in contributing to the earlier extinction of the very things they say they are intending to preserve- the wondrous influence of Microcars for future generations.
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Stew- sorry to run out of space before answering your question.
The bigger issue required addressing.
I am being environmentally incorrect by strongly leaning toward a Vespa 200cc. I love the fact that it is still a 2 stroke, fits without further body mods and has a 4 speed manual transmission.
Not to mention that it will go like stink, preserve the low c.g. and even start reliably with available electronic ignition.
All this while maintaining the appearance of a period correc- if not politically correct powerplant. I don't think that the total number of miles I drive it will outweigh the positive effect on the earth's atmosphere that I have contributed by my almost exclusively driving my super ultra low emission vehicle (SULEV Honda Insight) for the last 10 years. But I will use relatively smokeless oils and feel a little guilty for my pleasure anyway.
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I feel no animosity toward new Peels. Indeed it has raised the profile of the idea of Peels but I am less sure if it has of real Peels since already there is a great deal of confusion out there. Does it really matter? Not greatly to me but likewise, as an owner of a real AC Cobra said to me 'Everyone assumes my car is a fake'. Bummer for the poser as it is worth a lot of money, fortunately he is happy that the few occasions he does take it out the General Public leave it alone. Every cloud etc etc.
Meanwhile I am off to breed fake Jewish people in an old Ford factory in Wales using pig hearts for the 'conservation of humans' version.
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I don't think that we will ever have quite the over population problem of the Cobra repros with Peels. They are just too inherently less driveable and they don't appeal to the great sea of wanna be Macho men out there.
Besides- when the viewing public finds out that they are actually staring at the real thing, the moment becomes even more appreciated by the aforementioned dilution factor.
Thank goodness the Messerschmitt makers weren't entirely successfull in extinguishing a breed of humans- so your pig hearted conservation measures will not be needed.
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where are you looking ?
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Hiya Keith from Yorkshire ;- my cars
:)
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My old cars, now moved on, my Bond bug long gone [ex wife] :'( and my three wheeler isetta 'Joey' how recently went to my brother Paul [Queensland, Australia
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Nice!
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Hello
After joining the forum last year, I finally have sourced a lovely Trojan! :D
Collecting in a week or so, not sure if my cheeks can cope with all the insane grinning!
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Very nice!
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have fun , i bet you do :)
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Indeed, you appear chipper as a chipmunk! :)
They store nuts in their cheek pouches, which can afford some relaxation of the facial muscles associated with maintaining a grin if properly arranged. You could use a couple of cotton balls, and get by with faked bilateral upper molar extractions if you wish.
Kidding aside, I am happy for you. Yours looks just like mine. But I haven't needed the cotton balls, because I probably need to take my engine out to check its cam timing and clean up its Dynastart, as, if my starting circuit is in a good mood, the engine runs clean, but spits a bit of gas spray back out its carb whilst so doing.
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You appear to have a large insect getting amorous with your car's instrument panel!
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Looks pretty hoopie. There are folk doing serious miles in these. What is under the sheet?
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What is under the sheet?
Er, the mattress!
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my Trojan was a little different on being purchased but oddly mine was supposedly painted to look like a bumble bee !!
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Mine before and after a bit of elbow grease:
http://s581.photobucket.com/user/Captain_Bubble/media/duf.jpg.html?sort=3&o=189
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well give us a clue Marcus which is before and which after ;D
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Its obvious Richard: that red paint was so horrid I had to cover it in that multi-coloured Artex and flaking rust!
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Like the advice on saving cheek ache! ;D
The Bee goes everywhere with me so was essential to include in this adventure! I'd of liked a yellow Heinkel Trojan to do up as a bee but no need to repaint this one so those plans are unlikely!
The car under cover is a 1920's Humber. The seller has done up a variety of interesting cars and then just keeps them nice without using them. I'm privileged to of had the tip-off on this car and prise it out of his hands offering an enthusiastic and loving new home! (With a toy bee as a travel mascot)
I'm a member of the Heinkel Trojan club so look forward to developing relations there too and I hope to take it along to Silverstone Classics. There doesn't seem to be a Bubble Car club stand there, it needs one IMO! :D
Thanks for all your welcome's and comments! :)
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Yes Flintstone Classic does seem to have slipped off the radar since I got a soaking there yonks ago. I think a lack of someone to take the infinitive and organize it. There are folk in the area but the active ones seem to be in a ring around it rather than on top of it. Yet Gaydon was offered for a few years to strokers and received little take up, indeed the last one featured more micro four strokes than two strokes!
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Stef- a little clue to save your cheeks from a reversion of work load.
Al is likely a synthesiac who speaks in riddles embroidered by hyperbole, that are correctly interperable at many levels that you will likely become at least somewhat more familiar with over time.
Should you need a more direct answer, he will most likely respond to a personal message with something quite useful, as he really does have a helpful heart, and has likely had the most micro experience of anyone currently active in this group.
Good to see your smiling face. Can we use it as a replacement for the original yellow smiley face in future posts? :)
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and if you think he's telling porkies ....
I've removed the photo of No plate above ...
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Awesome cars, everyone! :)
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new member/new car all the way from poland. enjoy
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Brilliant! Welcome.
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Welcome to the forum!
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No plate back again , the red X is a mystery ?
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came across the makers plate for the above No plate whilst looking for other bits . though I'm sure there was one on the car ?
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Here are a few pictures of the recovery of my Nobel.
They are not the best as they are scans from poor digital prints.
They show the car as it had been stored and after we got it out of the garden.
sadly I can't find any images of the car being lifted over the fence.
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New member here. I am based in North Alabama, USA, and always been fascinated with microcars. I was fortunate to visit the Bruce Weiner Museum (only about 150 miles away) just weeks before the collection was sold. As a boy my brothers and I used to view the advertisements for the King Midget, and occasionally I would run across one at a car show. So when I got a chance several years ago to purchase a real "Barn Find" I leaped at the chance. Mine is a 1959 Model III, with the 9.25 HP Wisconsin engine. I have restored the car to its original condition. I will try to attach two photos, one before I started the restoration and one just out of the paint shop.
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Welcome Tom.
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Hi All following my earlier post here are some pics
Best wishes John
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What is your favorite car?
I like the Rolls Royce Phantom. How about (http://aboutmens.com/) you?
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Welcome Lucy.
Whilst our members likely have respect for other classes of vehicles, it would be considered appropriate to the context of this forum if you would steer your discussion toward the class of cars referred to as "microcars" -vehicles with engine displacements of less than 700 c.c.s.
It would befit the intention of this particular blog if you would limit your participation to that of posting pictures and comments related to any cars that you have owned that meet this requirement.
Have you owned any microcars?
Tell us if you have a favorite Microcar, and if so why you prefer the one(s) that you especially like.
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For now I own a Ford Fiesta which I'm happy with, but in the future it is my biggest dream to have a microcar. I especially like Nobels. Hopefully some day I will have the money to buy one.
Thank you for all the pictures guys, it gave me a lot of inspiration as to what I want in the future!
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Hi Helen welcome . If you like Nobels here is a photo of a paticularly nice one owned by a friend. Hope you get one of your own sometime .
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Good news Helen!
Your good taste in Microcars mirors that of my own, and for reason(s) never completely understood by myself,
allows you a purchase price likely not needing to exceed about 40% of what you would expect to need to pay for a base Messerschmitt or Isetta in equivalent condition.
So you may be able to afford one sooner than you think!
I should know, as during the last decade I ended up obtaining 2 and a half of them for about $11,000 USD total.
If you are living in the UK, you are especially blessed, as this is where they are the most plentiful and undervalued.
They use the same engine as a Messerschmitt, and have not too much too tricky about them, except for their plywood floor and perspex rear window.
So find one with a solid wood floor (pay particular attention to the area just inside the doors and also forward of the footwells) and your off to the races. Euphamistically speaking that is, as is common in the world of microcars, usable speed is limited to only about 45 m.p.h.
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Register of some Nobels.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/z1znp53zks28ycf/AAAIi6rPi8Ss7CPldMOXce9fa?dl=0
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The last one in your register-YYK663 had a for sale sign on it.
If it were indeed the last to make your register, perhaps it could be still available for our new found friend.
Any way to follow up for her?
I was shocked to see my red white and blue XUV787 represented in 10 pictures that I was unaware of.
8 of them must have been taken at the Queen's English car show in Woodley Park in Burbank CA a few years ago.
Two of them look like they may have been snapped before I bought her in Ohio in 2009.
How on Earth did you get a hold of these pics?
Microcar paparazzi?
I am literally leaning up against it as I write, as I like to go through my email on my back patio.
It's rear end had been up on blocks for quite some time while I find the time and info needed to transplant the power train into the engine cradle that came with the 1/2 car that I got to allow me to make it into a four wheeler.
I brought my red and white to the same show a few years later- surprised that they missed it.
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Some Period photos.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/l2t4k314vkazabw/AABzgZwUoCN6_JHA4-TnElFpa?dl=0
It's a long time since I added anything Steven so no chance of a sale.
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Throw 39 sexy Nobel pics (I particularly like number 13 where the aeroplane seems to be devouring one), and maybe I'll not remember to notice that you didn't answer my biggest question?
Not so fast buster.
I repeat myself- what was/ were the source(s) of your previously posted pics of my red white and blue car XUV787?
Have you sponsored a spy in my midst?
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I expect that Barry, just like me has found them whilst surfing the net. It is far easier to capture images than to record exactly where they came from (and even then, where you find them is often not the original source!). These might possibly have come from when Jonathan Poll had his Nobel website on weebly or there are a couple here http://www.3wheelers.com/archives/archive3/body_gal231.html
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I don't keep a record of where I found the photos. They will all be in the public domain, possibly in obscure places.
When I see something interesting on-line, I save it.
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Thanks for the simple explanation. I guess that I should have realized that a simple web search was all that was needed.
The link that Malcolm posted was extremely interesting to me, as it shows the former owner of the Petite and Nobel in apparently good health enjoying his imports at least several years before I flew from LA to West Allis Wisconsin to purchase the vehicles.
Come to think of it, this all came about because in 2009 I was frantically web searching for "Nobel 200 for sale", having fallen in love with the make at a transcontinental outing to Bruce Weiner's museum. But all i could come up with was a two year old obscure reference from a non Microcar blog where someone was asking how much an AC Petite and Nobel 200 should sell for.
A bit of detective work and follow up, got me in touch with the author, and low and behold- the question never got answered, and the cars still needed to be sold. After establishing their price, I mailed along a small good faith deposit based on just a couple of pictures and a description as neither car had run in years. Still it was primailly a verbally secured deal with the daughter of the now deceased owner.
Sometimes you have to trust your gut, and fortunately for me, this time was an example of that. The daughter was quite honorable and did not take advantage of the fact that I would not have wanted to have waisted the trip, and stuck with the agreed price, drove my girlfriend and I around to see the local sights, and even put us up in their own house for the stay!
Very friendly locals.
Which made it all the more surprising to find out that she went to the same high school as Jeffry Dalmer, the infamous apparently reserved but actual canabilistic mass murderer that they made a film about. A couple of other mass murders also came from this sleepy town.
All in all an adventurous and very productive trip that started with a desperate search and succeeded as a result of my betting on a good hunch.
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I often wonder if there are any Nobels in the US from the 1960's. When it was on show in New York in 1960, they boasted of an order for 3000 cars - which obviously never came to pass, likewise plans for the Satellite Corp of Wiscasset to assemble (and later manufacture) the car in Maine.
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Unfortunately, I have not heard of many that have made it to the US in period.
When I visited West Allis in 2009 I was shown a picture of a fully grinning prowd new owner standing in front of an open 20' shipping container that contained the AC Petite, Nobel 200, and a Messerschmitt. At that time the picture looked to be at least a couple of decades old.
The cars were all basically longitudinally oriented, but the tapered ends of the Messerschmitt and Nobel faced each other and the vehicles were both canted and offset from centerline of the container's longitudinal axis- this plus the narrowness of all 3 cars allowed their combined length of approximately 30 feet to be accommodated in the 20 foot container that was shipped from England.
I used a similar strategy a few years later to bring in what turned out to be Nobel 200 parts car, Frisky Family Three, and Trojan 200.
That success emboldened me to hatch my plan to some day find eight Sans Permis vehicles short enough to be fit sideways in a 40 foot container. After 14 months of frantic searching and emails I realized that dream in 2015.
Now the last load of eight is accommodated in a longitudinal tandem orientation in a 12' x 32' long end section of my barn, and I am about to petition my city to hopefully become allowed to lengthen my barn another 20' to become enabled to get it to contain the greater percentage of my collection.
Most of the cars are unfinished projects, and I do good work, but very slowly. As it turns out, I am now finally enjoying the process of coming up with creative solutions for getting everything that is not a vehicle off of the barn floor so I will have greater access and space to enjoy the views of my unusual lots.
Most rewarding solution so far has been my deciding to store a large pile of long unused antique redwood floorboards in the rafters, thus creating storage space for many more lighter wieght items without blocking ambient lighting from the 4O' x 2' long skylight that I created by replacing the rotted sections of corrugated galvanized roofing panels with very hard to find translucent fiberglass roofing panels with identically dimensioned and spaced corrugations.
I still have about 100 of these 3' x4' 40 year old panels that have never seen sun, but we're intended for green house use to find space for. So I will continue my project of replacing the remaining 5 of 8 solid metal windows with 4 panel thick stacks of them, and then hopefully find a way to tuck the large number of them remaining up inside the perfectly matched corrugated surface of the barn's interior walls at a height that keeps them off the floor so as not to unnecessarily consume more useful interior wall storage.
I'm nearing retirement, but will certainly never have want for things to do.